Changing times with a difference: The SPD realizes that the Greens are not just partners, and in Berlin the first new black-red coalition is even starting. Soon also in the Bund? Exciting qualifying for Sandra Maischberger’s position test!
The guests
▶︎ Friedrich Merz (67, CDU). The party and opposition leader grumbles: “In the federal government, everyone does what they want. There is no coordination by the Federal Chancellor!”
▶︎ Lars Klingbeil (45, SPD). The chancellor party leader reassured: “The traffic light was never endangered. Now that’s another chance for a new start.” Yes, of course…
▶︎ Daniela Schwarzer (50). The foreign policy expert warns: “China is clearly on Russia’s side, but is trying to show that it takes a neutral position – but of course it isn’t!”
▶︎ Jörg Pilawa (57). The TV quizmaster used to work as a driver for Hape Kerkeling when he was a student.
▶︎ Sabine Rennefanz (48). The “Spiegel” columnist would have “preferred that the nuclear power plants would continue to operate, at least as a bridging technology.”
▶︎ Michael Broecker (46). The editor-in-chief (“The Pioneer”) judged the shutdowns: “Common sense did not guide this action!”
Duel at eye level! Friedrich Merz is 1.98 meters tall, Lars Klingbeil 1.96 meters, but this is not about the ranges of Bundesliga goalkeepers: The Zoff-o-Meter hopes for groundbreaking impressions from the political summit region!
Most disappointed political shaming
For the quizmaster Pilawa, the shutdown of nuclear power is “a black day for the German debate culture”, because: “I find it shameful how nuclear technology has once again become a political pawn in the last few months!”
▶︎ Pilawa’s rationale: “Twice we started discussions that were fear-driven. Once in 2011, that was the fear of Fukushima. Now we are afraid of the blackout and the rising prices. If we had done our homework we wouldn’t have a problem!”
TV presenter Jörg Pilawa
Most Treacherous Bashing
The “Spiegel” columnist Rennefanz makes no secret of her antipathies: “The CDU has driven an absolute serpentine line,” she claims. “In 2011, who shouted the loudest that we had to shut down the nuclear power plants? That was the prime ministers Mappus and Söder!” Well? Did the SPD and the Greens play mouse back then?
▶︎ But: “It’s all a bit ideologically driven for me,” Rennefanz admits. Because: “Poland, Great Britain, even Finland are building nuclear power plants.” And: “I think it’s a shame that we now have to let the lignite-fired power plants run longer. A totally absurd situation.
Most enlightening trick
Maischberger heats up the debate with what is currently the most-discussed quote from Habeck: “Ukraine will stick to nuclear power,” announced the Economics Minister. “That’s fine too, as long as things run smoothly. You are built.”
“That could also apply to Germany,” the talk show host notes. Is that “a sign that this is really an ideological decision here?”
“I’ve rarely been so close to Robert Habeck,” grins the editor-in-chief of “Pioneer” Bröcker. “Replace ‘Ukraine’ with ‘Germany’ and he’s absolutely right!”
“Pioneer” Editor-in-Chief Michael Bröcker
Most failed humor attack
The group contradicted the next quote much more vigorously: “The shutdown of nuclear power is a serious mistake,” Söder said. “Bavaria is therefore offering to continue running nuclear power under its own responsibility for a few years.”
Huuuu! The Bavarians! How creepy! Pilawa tries his hand at satire: “In 2011, Söder threatened to resign if you withdraw from the withdrawal of the shutdown of the nuclear power plants. He’s about to step down now…”
Most successful backflip
When no one laughs, the entertainer saves himself in the traffic light defensive position: “We could allow Bayern to do it, but then Söder should commit to building the first repository,” he demands. Still no one laughs, but at least Pilawa gets applause.
The other guests show solidarity: “Mr. Söder’s ideas are often of particular radiance,” Rennefanz remembers. The “Söder method” describes the “Spiegel” journalist as “a lot of wind, little energy”. Bröcker laughs at the top of his lungs. His verdict: “Markus Söder is Markus Söder!” Moan …
“Spiegel” columnist Sabine Rennefanz
Clearest promise
In the top duel, Merz and Klingbeil beat old quotes and new allegations around their ears for minutes. They can’t get past Söder either.
The CDU leader steadfastly refuses to criticize the CSU leader for the idea of a Bavarian nuclear power plant. “I support any reasonable proposal that will allow us to increase our power generation capacity!”, he makes clear.
Most obvious suspicion
▶︎ Klingbeil prefers to be the party man rather than the statesman: Söder’s proposal was “due to the election campaign,” he blasphemed. His smug advice: “Markus Söder should finally start building wind turbines in Bavaria and photovoltaic systems, like mine in Lower Saxony!”
Friedrich Merz countered with an announcement: “This week we will submit a motion to the Bundestag that states that the systems will not be wantonly scrapped!”
“Because,” the CDU leader continued, “that’s also a plan of the coalition: They want to scrap these systems immediately in an urgent procedure so that nobody can think of putting them back into operation. She wants to ban all research!”
Most naive question
“Are you going into the federal election campaign with the promise that if you win, you’ll turn the whole thing back?” the talk show host wants to know.
“I’m not planning the next federal election campaign today!” Merz wonders.
“Why not?” Maischberger asks innocently and tilts his head while waiting. Hm, maybe because she herself isn’t already planning talk topics for 2025?
Airy attack
▶︎ Merz remains diplomatic: “Imagine we then have a war between Taiwan and China. Then we have completely different issues than the question of which nuclear power plants will then still be operated in Germany!”
Klingbeil is now on the attack: “I only hear from the Union what is not possible,” he scolds. “And that’s not enough!”
Most objective accusation
Merz casually crosses his hands over his knees. “By the end of March, the coalition had submitted 196 legislative procedures and motions to the Bundestag,” he calculates. “We agreed at 97. We submitted 190 suggestions. Now I’ll ask you: how many did you agree to?”
The SPD boss has to fit. “I have no idea,” he admits.
The CDU leader leans forward: “Not a single suggestion!” he explains to Klingbeil. Ui!
Boldest claim
The head of the SPD wants to get out of trouble with counter-accusations, but the talk show host immediately brushes him off: “Did you really not agree to a single suggestion?” She asks incredulously.
Suddenly in need of explanation, the beleaguered leader of the SPD unleashed an uncontrolled liberation: “If you look at the history of the Bundestag, you will not see that opposition motions are approved,” he claims.
Moderator Sandra Maischberger with the two party leaders
Most energetic rejection
Merz crosses his arms in front of his chest. “Oh!” he exclaims in surprise. The talk show host is also surprised: “Even if they make sense?”
Klingbeil wants to pull the CDU leader into the shaky boat: “That’s normal parliamentary procedure, you know that too!” He claims.
But Merz balks: “No, I don’t know!” He contradicts, “and I’ve witnessed opposition and government times!”
Last Stand
Klingbeil struggles for words: “Because Mr. Merz is not quite there: we also have things in common …”
“What does ‘not quite on the way’ mean?” the CDU leader interjects. “Do you think I’m insane?” Oha! The studio audience is audibly amused. “Caution!” warns Sandra Maischberger.
Most striking similarities
So it won’t be anything more with black and red? In Maischberger’s popular question game, the party leaders then come closer again. Minimum wage? Merz: “Not the task of politics.” Klingbeil: “I agree with Mr. Merz.”
Tax increases for high incomes? Klingbeil: “I was happy about the Union’s proposal.” Merz: “We’re discussing it, but we haven’t decided yet.” Klingbeil: “Perhaps that would be the first proposal that we would agree to.”
clearest comments
About cancellation claims against Springer boss Mathias Döpfner Klingbeil judges because of private comments about East Germans. “I consider these statements to be unacceptable and dangerous.”
Merz comments: “It is not my decision whether he resigns in a private company, but I have had other experiences with the East Germans, and very good experiences at that.”
Most forgiving ending
Regarding Germany’s China policy after the Foreign Minister’s courageous performance in Beijing, Merz explains: “Today we presented a corresponding paper. But that can only be part of it. We expressly offer the federal government that we do this together.”
“Because,” the CDU leader continued, “this is not a question of government and opposition, it is a question of our common position.”
Strongest Warning
“China doesn’t want the West to turn away now,” reports expert Schwarzer, but: “China is also pursuing the idea of self-sufficiency. You want to make yourself more independent. That’s why it invests so much in its own innovative strength. That is why it has already overtaken Europe in many areas.”
The danger, according to the expert: “China is trying to reshape global order structures so that it can better implement its own interests. That is why the transatlantic alliance is so important from a European perspective. We need the US. We are not defensible.”
quote of the evening
“I am proud that we now have the third Federal Chancellor to receive the highest medal in the Federal Republic.” Friedrich Merz on Angela Merkel
Conclusion
Exciting head-to-head race through difficult terrain, the party leaders kept on accelerating, there were a couple of crashes, but nobody wanted to risk a total loss. That was a talk show in the “reasonable” category.