Munich: Anti-populism demo “Ausge-Trumpt” in July – Bavaria

The SPD and the Greens, trade unions and associations are calling for the “Ausge-Trumpt” anti-populism demonstration on July 1 in Munich. Bayern SPD leader Florian von Brunn came up with the idea. His party thinks the anti-heating law demonstration in Erding two weeks ago showed that democracy “must be defended anew every day.” In the SZ interview, Brunn talks about culture struggles, about Markus Söder and Hubert Aiwanger and about the risk that the counter-demo could fuel polarization in the state election campaign even more.

SZ: Mr. von Brunn, did you have an invitation to the Erdinger demo?

Florian von Brunn: No. I certainly wouldn’t have gone either.

FDP country chief Martin Hagen was in Erding, although his party also governed in the federal government.

It was clear to me from the start that I had a different position. There was no demonstration in Erding for a constructive proposal on how to make the Building Energy Act more social and affordable. I am also of the opinion that, in addition to climate-friendly district heating, the heat pump is a good solution.

Now call for the counter-demo. Title: “Ausge-Trumpt”. What do you mean by that?

That it is wrong to start a culture war from the right now. We need to talk about apartments and wind turbines, not Winnetou and Wolf. We have specific problems. Not only affordable housing and affordable energy prices, but also the transformation of the economy to climate neutrality. Are lessons at school secured? Can I get a daycare place? These are the issues that we should concern ourselves with in politics. And don’t use mock political debates to fuel the discussion even more.

And the Trump reference?

I see a similar development as in the USA, where society is split down the middle. And parts of society no longer believe even scientifically proven facts. We also experienced that here, with Corona, and we experience it with the climate. As with Trump, even democratic elections are now being questioned.

Free Voters boss Hubert Aiwanger said in Erding that the “silent majority” had to “take back democracy”.

This is a very negative development. With our demo we want to show that the Democrats stand together. And take a stand for progressive politics. In Bavaria we are currently experiencing a policy going in the opposite direction, for example in the area of ​​climate protection. That’s not how we solve the problems. We need reforms, but we have to take people with us.

After the demo in Erding, the organizer, cabaret artist Monika Gruber, announced an even bigger demo on Munich’s Theresienwiese. After the compromise on the heating law, she rejected these plans. They still want to demonstrate. Why?

We demonstrate for progressive and social politics. For concrete solutions instead of right-wing populist Kulturkampf. And that independently of Ms. Gruber’s other actions.

Are we really in a culture war in Bavaria?

I already see a culture war with Mr. Söder and Mr. Aiwanger and that they are spreading misinformation. If there is talk of “forced veganization”, then that is a lie. The recommendation to eat only ten grams of meat a day appears in a calculation model by the German Society for Nutrition (DGE), but nobody has ever recommended it, especially not Federal Minister of Agriculture Cem Özdemir. I also think the claim that we will soon be able to heat with hydrogen is far-fetched and an excuse to continue using gas heating. The Greens are being beaten up in a shameful way.

You throw yourself protectively in front of the Greens?

With this type of political attack, I see the danger that there will also be physical attacks on Green politicians in the near future. It is certainly the case that the Building Energy Act was not well communicated, that the draft was not what we had in mind. That’s why we’re still discussing it in the Bundestag. Factual criticism is justified, but I find this kind of agitation wrong.

“Ausge-Trumpt” – but that’s also a point.

Yes, but that very clearly indicates a danger. The message is: watch out! Don’t talk like Trump! Because that divides society. You have to stick together as democratic forces.

Who started the Kulturkampf? The blame is diligently shifted back and forth.

Our society has been changing for decades, and in many cases rightly so. Violence in the family is now sanctioned and no longer accepted. Now we are trying to get discrimination and violence out of the language. These are legitimate concerns. However, it is up to each individual whether he has changed or not changed, for example. You can always argue where it goes too far. argue democratically. But I don’t see anyone being forced to be vegan or gender.

Prime Minister Markus Söder (CSU) has demarcated to the right in Erding. Anders Aiwanger, his deputy. Don’t you make a difference?

But. Mr. Aiwanger is obviously trying to win over AfD voters with right-wing populist statements. He shows few scruples and does not clearly differentiate himself from fascist, right-wing extremist parties like the AfD. Herr Söder did it, that was right, they booed him for it. But he raises similar issues and uses vocabulary similar to Aiwanger’s: “gender coercion”, “forced veganization”. False information for election campaign reasons, I find that shabby. And he made the mistake of appearing in Erding at all. That’s how he made the demo important in the first place.

Aren’t you worried that extreme forces will also appear in your counter-demo, just from the left?

The danger is always there. But we do not address these forces. My impression was that there were already a lot of lateral thinkers, AfDlers and climate deniers in Erding.

A total of 13,000 were in Erding. Will this now be a showdown of who will mobilize more people?

We would be happy if we get more on the road.

You say you don’t want division like in the US. Isn’t there a risk that your counter-demo will deepen the divisions that already exist?

I have no worries about that. If you criticize other political tendencies, but treat each other fairly and can still shake hands, the danger is not there. In principle, the democratic parties that are now arguing are always able to form a joint government. But I see a danger if the Free Voters move further to the right. I think their course is problematic.

Söder and Aiwanger accuse you of having fished on the right edge in Erding for tactical reasons. You can also get an impression of the tactics from your demo. Is this the chance to make yourself known as the SPD’s top candidate?

That’s not what drives me.

At least Erding has suddenly given you an election campaign topic.

We already had the right topics beforehand. I just don’t think it’s good for democracy if right-wing populist issues are made socially acceptable. It was seen in the 2018 election campaign that democratic parties are losing. That the AfD will only be strengthened. I also see this danger now, that’s the reason for the demo.