Chris Harrison Shades ‘Bachelor’ Ratings, Says Wells Should Host

“[There are] a few people that are sitting in Hollywood right now nervous as hell that I am doing a podcast — and I guess I would say to those people, if you’re nervous, maybe you should be.” Chris Harrison brings the theatrics on his new show, “The Most Dramatic Podcast Ever,” but did he deliver? Us Weekly is breaking down the first two episodes of the former Bachelor host’s new venture.

The 51-year-old reality TV host goes solo on the premiere episode, released by iHeartRadio on Monday, January 9, before he’s joined by fiancée Lauren Zima for his second installment. Throughout two hours, Harrison details what it was like to navigate the backlash of his February 2021 interview that ultimately cost him his gig with the franchise.

“I was heartbroken. And I was gutted. I was embarrassed. I was mad at myself. I was disappointed in myself. The last thing in the world I ever wanted to do was be an agent of anything negative. Whether it had to do with race, or anything, the fact that I was involved in this and that I had a big part in this, I do own that,” Harrison said.

He added that there were ”many things out of [his] control” and “things definitely spun out of control for a number of reasons.”

As Bachelor Nation will recall, Harrison came under fire when asked about resurfaced photos of Bachelor season 25 contestant (and eventual winner) Rachael Kirkconnell at a college party in an antebellum-style dress. At the time, he told Rachel Lindsay, the first Black Bachelorette who now works for Extra, that fans need to have “a little grace, a little understanding, a little compassion” for Kirkconnell, who had yet to speak out.

“Who is Rachel Lindsay and who is Chris Harrison and who is whatever woke police person out there, who are you? I’ve heard this a lot of, ‘I think she should,’ ‘I think he should.’ Who the hell are you? Who are you that you demand that?” Harrison said during the controversial chat.

Harrison apologized via an Instagram statement and ABC subsequently hired Emmanuel Acho to host Matt James’ After the Final Rose in March 2021. Months later, Harrison’s official exit from the franchise was announced. (Kaitlyn Bristowe and Tayshia Adams were tapped to host seasons 17 and 18 of The Bachelorette before Jesse Palmer took over.)

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“I wasn’t my normal, eloquent self. I didn’t express myself like I normally do. I think that part we all agree on,” Harrison said on Monday. “But as far as my standing in the community and the show, it really didn’t register on the Richter scale. There was much more egregious things going on in the world and things that had happened.”

Harrison implied that his bosses “didn’t really think it was going to amount to much” and was told that if he apologized, “We would be able to move forward.”

“I had someone, a very prominent person say to me, ‘You know, the mistake you made Chris, you apologized.’ And I understood what that person was trying to say,” he explained. “But I said, ‘I disagree with you. My apology was warranted. Because I did misstep. And I made a mistake.’”

Harrison went on to compare things to Stranger Things’ The Upside Down.

“I think the timing of this is very relevant of where we were in the world. We were all coming out of two years of being locked up. And I think we were all angry and frustrated and then culturally, what was going on in the world with civil rights and there was a lot of confusion, anger and resentment,” Harrison said. “It was a very combustible moment in time. And my timing of being sloppy, inappropriate, and wrong in that moment — that’s on me to have not seen that. You know, I was just as frustrated and blind and pissed off as everybody else in the world coming out of what we came out of. But that’s not to say that was OK. … I had no problem putting out that first apology, it was a written apology that I put out on Instagram. But there was just so much noise at the time. It just didn’t matter. Apologies didn’t matter. And I’ve never seen a time like that in my life, I’ve never known that not to work … if you sincerely apologize and open your heart.”

Scroll through for more from Harrison:

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Lost 20 Pounds Amid ‘Bachelor’ Exit

Harrison said he was “sick to my stomach” during the aftermath of the Extra interview. “And I lost 20 pounds. I didn’t sleep. I didn’t eat,” he said. “I was scared to death of — not of my job, but of my family. My fianceé, who God bless Lauren Zima for being there every step of the way. … I worried about my kids. I worried about my family, my mom, my dad, my brother, all my loved ones, my friends.”

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Stands By His Point

“While the point I was trying to get across, I stay by,” Harrison said. “The way I did it, it was messy, it was disappointing and it’s just not me. …  It was a messy, really bad conversation.”

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Relates to Harry & Meghan

Harrison revealed that situation “crushed” him and he wished he was able to address the viewers more directly, but claims he was instructed to keep quiet. He compared the situation to what Prince Harry and Meghan Markle said about the palace in their Netflix doc, Harry & Meghan.

“I still have this policy of, like, if you want to come have a debate with me, if you want to talk, bring an open heart and an open mind and open ears and man, I will discuss anything with you. And I just wanted that so badly. It wasn’t that I wasn’t allowed to, but I wasn’t counseled to do that,” he said. “You know what the royal family or the royal press folk were like, ‘Don’t speak. Don’t give them anything, because they will take anything you do say and it will be held against you in the court of public opinion.’”

He continued: “I guess the best analogy is if you were in a tsunami — or if you’re a surfer, if you’ve ever been surfing, there’s a huge wave and this massive wave, you don’t make it over the top. And so you get thrown down to the bottom of the ocean and it’s like you’re in a washing machine, you’re getting thrown around, but it’s over, right? In about five, eight seconds, if you hold your breath, and you keep your head above you, you float to the top, and it’s over. And you when you come up, it’s actually really serene, it’s really Placid, it’s calm. But that wave is rolling on in. It’s destroying more and it’s loud. And that’s how I felt because when I got hit by this wave, and I was being thrown around, the decision was made, ‘OK, apologize,’ which I did and then, ‘Don’t speak,’ and that’s what I was counseled. And I tentatively agreed, ‘OK, this too shall pass.’ … But that noise in this moment in time  didn’t stop. And that’s where the playbook was thrown out the window. And that’s what none of us were prepared for.”

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‘Bachelor’ Ratings

While Harrison said repeatedly that he has “love” for a lot of people at The Bachelor, he threw shade at the ratings — and some of the higher-ups.

“I’m not mad at the show. The show changed my life. And I am grateful to The Bachelor and Bachelorette … There is no animosity. Now, was it a job where parts of it that sucked? Sure, it’s a job,” he said.” You know, tell me a job where you love your boss, and you love everyone you work for. It’s very rare. And God bless you if you do you found that. … The majority of people, I love and adored. Look, the show was a massive success. It’s a historic show. It changed television in many ways, one of the most relevant television shows in history. And to be a part of that, to have helped create that over 19 years. I take great pride in that.”

When Zima joined in episode 2, she added: “There are people at the show who are very problematic still.”

Harrison noted that he hasn’t watched his James’ hometown episode.

“When I left, it was still the number No. 1 show on TV. Now look, do I keep an eye on the ratings? Do I know what’s happening now? I’m not going to say I’m not so humble or whatever to say, I haven’t paid attention to the scoreboard,” he admitted. “Yes, I do know. … I realized the ratings are down 50 to 60 percent and the show has changed dramatically. But also, that hurts me a little bit because it’s something I took pride in building. And there’s still some wonderful people that I talk to on the show, cast members and crew.”

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Nick Viall and Wells Adams Wanted ‘Bachelor’ Hosting Gig

Both the season 21 Bachelor and Bachelor in Paradise bartender were open about wanting Harrison’s gig.

“I knew about certain cast members who were calling in. And the funny thing is, the people who were calling in I knew had no chance to get the job,” Harrison said on episode 1 without naming names.

During episode 2, he addressed Viall directly, explaining: “Nick wasn’t really strongly against me or said anything. But, you know, I think Nick was one of those among many who probably saw the blood in the water and saw the opportunity of a job that would be really phenomenal. And I had no doubt he wanted that job. But we saw each other at Wells and Sarah’s [Hyland] wedding and gave each other big hugs.”

Harrison also revealed that he thought Adams was the man for the job. (He never referenced Palmer getting hired.)

“Wells has always been a very good man and a good friend of mine,” Harrison said. “Wells was in a very difficult situation because obviously he was still kind of connected to the show and he was doing stuff on Paradise, but he was one of the first to reach out to me and just say, ‘Look, I’m staying out of this. I love you and respect you.’ … I thought, to be completely candid, that Wells was going to get the job. …  I even told him, I said, ‘Hey, man, I won’t speak out publicly because I don’t think that will help you at all. In fact, it would do a lot more harm than good. But I really hope you get the job. I think you’d be great at it.’”

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On Which Alums Reached Out

“I told everyone, ‘Please don’t speak.’ It didn’t matter who it was or what you said, you were going to be devoured,” Harrison said of family members and former Bachelor and Bachelorettes who wanted to defend him. “I didn’t want that for anybody else.”

After noting it was “tough” to start naming names, he went on to list a series of people from the franchise who were there for him.

“Catherine and Sean [Lowe], who I love and adore. Arie and Lauren [Luyendyk]. Brad Womack. … Trista and Ryan [Sutter], JP [Rosenbaum] and Ashley [Hebert] and Jade [Roper] and Tanner [Tolbert],” he said. “JoJo [Fletcher] and Jordan [Rodgers], who Lauren and I love so much. Bob Guiney and Andrew Firestone.”

Harrison also named Ben Higgins, Ashley Iaconetti, Andi Dorfman, Sarah Herron, Leslie Murphy, Tenley Molzahn, Jake Pavelka, Chris Soules, Adam Gottschalk and Raven Gates and Eric Bigger.

“Mike Johnson was one who was very critical [and] outspoken as soon as this happened and understandably so. And we ran into each other, ironically, in Vegas at an iHeart event, and gave each other a big hug, had nothing but love,” Harrison continued. “He reached out to me while we were sitting there and spending time together and just thanked me for being kind of that big brother and always being there for him.”

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Lauren Zima Gets Emotional

“Lauren and I had a very difficult time getting through this together, because this happened to her as much as it happened to me,” Harrison said. He added in episode 2: “In the end, it brought us together more and made me love her more.”

When Zima joined in the second episode, she got emotional. “I think the hardest part was understanding it. Because I didn’t feel like I was watching you,” she said of the now-infamous interview. “I know that wasn’t you in that interview. … What was being perceived was not how you felt in your heart. And I knew that and so I was also just mad because I thought, ‘How could you do this? How could you be so messy? How could you not see how you were sounding?’ But what I quickly realized is that everybody makes mistakes. … And to me, the most important thing about a human is: what their intention is and how they react after they make a mistake. And I knew that your intention in that interview was in no way malicious. I knew that your intention was to protect Matt.”

Zima went on to address how the situation led to the end of her Entertainment Tonight Bachelor recap show, “Roses and Rosé.”

“’Roses and Rosé’ [was] such a joy in my life for me. How I felt about my job changed a lot after I stopped that because I realized that was really what I got so much happiness from. I wasn’t ready to end that show,” she said. “One thing in looking at the interview and in seeing how you’ve been in the past year and a half since it’s all been over is — I’ve realized how frustrated you were at work. … People felt like ‘Oh, is this a side of him I’ve just never seen?’ No. That wasn’t the truth of you. It was a very frustrated burnt-out tired version of you. …  I know you were so worried that this controversy was happening [with] Rachel Kirkconnell and you wanted her and Matt to not break up you wanted Matt to be OK. You didn’t want Matt to be going through all this. So all that frustration and exhaustion went into that interview.”

Zima added that she “wasn’t told” by ET to stop doing “Roses and Rosé,” adding: “I stopped because I could not live with myself covering the franchise like that anymore. I couldn’t celebrate it in the same way knowing everything that I know now.”