The AfD will continue to vote on their candidates and their program for the 2024 European elections at the weekend. After the well-known Dexit plans, the political scientist Prof. Floris Biskamp says star: There is no longer any opposition to extreme positions in the party.
Mr Biskamp, the AfD is celebrating its tenth anniversary. How close is the party to its origins?
In the beginning, the party was not a right-wing extremist party, today it is. This open right-wing extremism has always existed in elements. The founders of the AfD have always believed that they could use this to get over the five percent hurdle. But whether Lucke, Petry or Meuthen – everyone had to learn that they cannot control it. That’s why the party is different today than it was ten years ago.
What is your impression of the current European election assembly?
The party congress over the last two weekends shows that the party has once again moved significantly to the right. Things like the conspiracy theory of the great exchange, the demand to throw millions of people out of Germany, extreme nationalism or queer hostility were also expressed before in the party. But what is new is that this time there is no objection to it.
From nobody?
Yesterday there was one person. But that was with Sylvia Limmer, who tried to get elected the week before. I don’t think that can be taken as a serious contradiction. Those elected always said the same thing in their speeches: hatred of migrants, devaluation of queers, hatred of the Greens, hatred of the EU. Those who were particularly drastic received particularly loud applause. This homogeneity and this tone, that was new.
What happened to the people who previously objected? Is there no more room for them in the AfD?
Either people left or they made peace with it. The candidates for the European elections are clear activists who have had wing positions from the start. But there are also people who no longer say anything against it. One can only speculate if they have changed their minds or are just opportunistic.
What should voters know about the people the AfD is currently nominating for the European elections?
These are people who believe that we do not live in a democracy. Who openly admit that they want to throw millions of people out of the country. Of course, they also know that this would only be possible with massive violence. And it is politicians who try to do politics with fear and sow hatred. They believe they live in a dictatorship and have a right to resist.
There is also a lot of talk about the Corona measures, as an example of how democracy has been undermined. I find that somewhat surprising in 2023. You want to counteract something completely different. What that is supposed to be is not explained in terms of content. It is only said that there should be no climate policy and, if possible, no migration.
On Sunday, the European election program will be discussed. What plans does the AfD have?
The AfD decided two years ago for the federal election that it stands for Dexit, i.e. Germany’s exit from the EU. In the run-up to this program party conference, it was disputed whether one would like the European Union to be handled in an orderly manner. However, if you listen to the speeches of the last few days, there is a relatively large consensus that the European Union should no longer exist in its current form, but at most something like a European Economic Community with a common internal market in which the states are much more independent meant to be. No one can say exactly how this is supposed to happen without major economic upheaval. They clearly don’t know that themselves.
timeline
From opponents of the euro to the case for the protection of the constitution: How the AfD has become more and more radical for years
You said in an interview that the entire party is where the Thuringian state association was two to three years ago. The so-called wing around Björn Höcke was present there. What are the consequences?
There were always people in the AfD who would have wanted something like the CDU of the 1980s with Kohl and Dregger and who would have been willing to be junior partners in a coalition with the CDU. It’s over.
Maximilian Krah is the AfD top candidate in the European elections. Politicians like him no longer want to govern with the CDU. Their aim is to destroy the CDU. The AfD is no longer a party that wants to play in the democratic system. They want to fundamentally attack and overthrow the social system in Germany and Europe. They say that quite openly.
How should the other parties deal with this AfD?
The CDU is currently facing a dilemma in East Germany. In Thuringia she has to decide whether she should either support the left-wing government under Bodo Ramelow or cooperate with the AfD. This is not an easy decision for the CDU, there are major differences in content between the Left Party and the CDU.
You have to choose between a democratic and an anti-democratic party.
That’s correct. But one should not make it too easy for oneself when criticizing the CDU. Just as it is painful for the Left Party to support the CDU when necessary, it is just as painful the other way around. But the Thuringian left wants to do democratic politics, while the AfD fundamentally rejects the political system. That’s why there can’t really be any collaboration with her. I still don’t have a simple recipe for how the CDU should react.
AfD boss Weidel also said last Saturday that the party only had to destabilize the so-called firewall once in the east, and then the breakthrough would be made. Do you agree with her?
I think she’s overly optimistic. In the case of the Left Party, for example, you can see that they are in coalition with the SPD in the eastern federal states. This is currently unlikely in the federal government. Where Alice Weidel is right is that the East German states are most likely to circumvent this ban on cooperation. Especially where there will be elections in the coming year – Saxony, Thuringia, Saxony-Anhalt.
The impact of the election results there also depends to a large extent on civil society. When the FDP politician Thomas Kemmerich was elected in Thuringia three years ago with the support of the AfD, it was quite relevant that there were demonstrations all over Germany in front of the party offices. That impresses the parties. And this reaction from civil society will have played its part in ensuring that this decision was quickly reversed.
The AfD achieves poll ratings like never before. Is your political course perhaps the recipe for success?
So far, at least, this radicalization hasn’t really stood in her way. At the same time, I don’t assume that all 20 to 23 percent who now state the AfD in the polls are really convinced of all their substantive points. They would probably also choose a Petry-AfD or a Meuthen-AfD. That’s bad enough, but not everyone wants this far-right AfD. If the AfD were a far-right party like in the Netherlands or other countries, it wouldn’t necessarily do worse.
A small restriction: In East Germany this radicalization does not seem to harm her, but in West Germany it does a little bit. You can see that this stigmatization for right-wing extremist parties is much less pronounced in East Germany than in the West. This can also be seen in the survey data.
The AfD has sister parties with extreme right-wing tendencies in other countries. Do you think the AfD is more dangerous than other parties in Europe?
It is noteworthy that many of these parties have softened their tone in recent years. If you compare the current leadership of the French Rassemblement National with the old leadership around Jean-Marie Le Pen, the party has become much more state-supporting and less extremist. The AfD is developing in the opposite direction. That makes her more dangerous.
Some parties no longer want to work with the AfD. When they made their Dexit decision two years ago, they were no longer invited to some international cooperation meetings. In Poland, for example, there is a radical right-wing government. But they are not at all enthusiastic when right-wing extremists in Germany harbor nationalistic fantasies, because Poland has a very painful history with them.
Is that also evident in the current European election assembly?
Yes, there were several guest speakers from international parties. But nobody from Italy or France was there. These are currently the largest and most important parties in this spectrum. But that could change if the AfD really moves into the European Parliament next year with 20 percent or more. Winners are always popular.
Prof. Floris Biskamp is a political scientist and researcher on right-wing extremism at the Catholic University of Eichstätt-Ingolstadt.